NSA Whistleblower ( Russell Tice ) Alleges Spying

NSA Whistleblower Alleges Illegal Spying
Former Employee Admits to Being a New York Times Source
By BRIAN ROSS
http://abcnews.go.com/WNT/print?id=1491889

Jan 10, 2006 - - Russell Tice, a longtime insider at the National
Security Agency, is now a whistleblower the agency would like to keep
quiet.

For 20 years, Tice worked in the shadows as he helped the United States
spy on other people's conversations around the world.

Watch the full report on Nightline at 11:35 p.m. ET.

"I specialized in what's called special access programs," Tice said of
his job. "We called them 'black world' programs and operations."

But now, Tice tells ABC News that some of those secret "black world"
operations run by the NSA were operated in ways that he believes
violated the law. He is prepared to tell Congress all he knows about the
alleged wrongdoing in these programs run by the Defense Department and
the National Security Agency in the post-9/11 efforts to go after
terrorists.

"The mentality was we need to get these guys, and we're going to do
whatever it takes to get them," he said.

Tracking Calls

Tice says the technology exists to track and sort through every domestic
and international phone call as they are switched through centers, such
as one in New York, and to search for key words or phrases that a
terrorist might use.

"If you picked the word 'jihad' out of a conversation," Tice said, "the
technology exists that you focus in on that conversation, and you pull
it out of the system for processing."

According to Tice, intelligence analysts use the information to develop
graphs that resemble spiderwebs linking one suspect's phone number to
hundreds or even thousands more.

Tice Admits Being a New York Times Source

President Bush has admitted that he gave orders that allowed the NSA to
eavesdrop on a small number of Americans without the usual requisite
warrants.

But Tice disagrees. He says the number of Americans subject to
eavesdropping by the NSA could be in the millions if the full range of
secret NSA programs is used.

"That would mean for most Americans that if they conducted, or you know,
placed an overseas communication, more than likely they were sucked into
that vacuum," Tice said.

The same day The New York Times broke the story of the NSA eavesdropping
without warrants, Tice surfaced as a whistleblower in the agency. He
told ABC News that he was a source for the Times' reporters. But Tice
maintains that his conscience is clear.

"As far as I'm concerned, as long as I don't say anything that's
classified, I'm not worried," he said. "We need to clean up the
intelligence community. We've had abuses, and they need to be
addressed."

The NSA revoked Tice's security clearance in May of last year based on
what it called psychological concerns and later dismissed him. Tice
calls that bunk and says that's the way the NSA deals with troublemakers
and whistleblowers. Today the NSA said it had "no information to
provide."

ABC News' Vic Walter and Avni Patel contributed to this report.

Copyright C 2006 ABC News Internet Ventures
==============================================
But the Americans who are so terrified by terrorism (because of
government media programming) gladly accept a carte blanche breach of
liberty, freedom and privacy, because Bush says so. What is needed, is
some balance so enemies are discovered, intelligence collected, and
action taken, without our government becoming (already became?) a
dictatorship like Saudi Arabia (whom we support). When Americans are
sold that we are in Iraq to install a democracy, we must get our own
house in order for that statement to be true.

Darren
avintel@netzero.com
==========================

Democracy Now! | National Security Agency Whistleblower Warns ...
Former NSA intelligence agent Russell Tice condemns reports that the Agency ...
AMY GOODMAN: Russell Tice, did you know anyone within the NSA who refused to ...
GOOGLE: NSA RUSSELL TICE

Russell Tice joins us now in our Washington studio. Welcome to Democracy Now!
http://www.afterdowningstreet.org/?q=node/6302

RUSSELL TICE: Good morning.

AMY GOODMAN: It’s good to have you with us.

RUSSELL TICE: Thank you.

AMY GOODMAN: What made you decide to come forward? You worked for the top-secret agency of this government, one that is far larger and even more secret than the C.I.A.

RUSSELL TICE: Well, the main reason is, you know, I'm involved with some certain aspects of the intelligence community, which are very closely held, and I believe I have seen some things that are illegal. Ultimately it's Congress's responsibility to conduct oversight in these things. I don't see it happening. Another reason is there was a certain roadblock that was sort of lifted that allowed me to do this, and I can't explain, but I will to Congress if allowed to.

AMY GOODMAN: Can you talk about the letter you have written to Congress, your request to testify?

RUSSELL TICE: Well, it’s just a simple request under the Intelligence Community Whistleblower Protection Act, which is a legal means to contact Congress and tell them that you believe that something has gone wrong in the intelligence community.

AMY GOODMAN: Can you start off by talking overall? Since most people until recently, until this latest story of President Bush engaging in these wiretaps of American citizens, as well as foreign nationals in this country, perhaps hadn't even heard of the N.S.A., can you just describe for us what is the National Security Agency? How does it monitor these communications?

RUSSELL TICE: Well, the National Security Agency is an agency that deals with monitoring communications for the defense of the country. The charter basically says that the N.S.A. will deal with communications of -- overseas. We're not allowed to go after Americans, and I think ultimately that’s what the big fuss is now. But as far as the details of how N.S.A. does that, unfortunately, I'm not at liberty to say that. I don’t want to walk out of here and end up in an F.B.I. interrogation room.

AMY GOODMAN: Russell Tice, you have worked for the National Security Agency. Can you talk about your response to the revelations that the Times, you know, revealed in -- perhaps late, knowing the story well before the election, yet revealing it a few weeks ago -- the revelation of the wiretapping of American citizens?

RUSSELL TICE: Well, as far as an intelligence officer, especially a SIGINT officer at N.S.A., we're taught from very early on in our careers that you just do not do this. This is probably the number one commandment of the SIGINT Ten Commandments as a SIGINT officer. You will not spy on Americans. It is drilled into our head over and over and over again in security briefings, at least twice a year, where you ultimately have to sign a paper that says you have gotten the briefing. Everyone at N.S.A. who’s a SIGINT officer knows that you do not do this. Ultimately, so do the leaders of N.S.A., and apparently the leaders of N.S.A. have decided that they were just going to go against the tenets of something that’s a gospel to a SIGINT officer.

AMY GOODMAN: We're talking to Russell Tice. We will go to break and come back to him. He’s a former intelligence agent with the National Security Agency and the Defense Intelligence Agency, worked at the N.S.A. up until May of this past year, May of 2005.

[break]

AMY GOODMAN: We talk to Russell Tice, former intelligence agent with the National Security Agency, formerly with the Defense Intelligence Agency, worked with the N.S.A. up until May 2005. Russell Tice, what happened then? What happened in May 2005?

RUSSELL TICE: Well, basically I was given my walking papers and told I was no longer a federal employee. So --

AMY GOODMAN: Why?

RUSSELL TICE: Some time ago I had some concerns about a co-worker at D.I.A. who exhibited the classic signs of being involved in espionage, and I reported that and basically got blown off by the counterintelligence office at D.I.A. and kind of pushed the issue, because I continued to see a pattern of there being a problem. And once I got back to N.S.A., I pretty much dropped the issue, but there was a report that came across my desk in April of 2003 about two F.B.I. agents that were possibly passing secret counterintelligence information to a Chinese double agent, Katrina Leung, and I sent a secure message back to the D.I.A. counterintelligence officer, and I said I think the F.B.I. is incompetent, and the retaliation came down on me like a ton of bricks.

AMY GOODMAN: What would you say to those who say you are speaking out now simply because you are disgruntled?

RUSSELL TICE: Well, I guess that’s a valid argument. You know, I was fired. But, you know, I’ve kind of held my tongue for a long time now, and basically, you know, I have known these things have been going on for a while. The classification level of the stuff I deal with, basically what we call black world programs and operations, are very, very closely held. And you know, whether you think this is retaliation or not, I have something important to tell Congress, and I think they need to hear it. I'd like to think my motives aren't retaliation, but, you know, after what I have been through, I can understand someone's argument to think I have been jaded.

AMY GOODMAN: What about the risks you take as a whistleblower? I wanted to play a clip of F.B.I. whistleblower, Sibel Edmonds. She was working for the F.B.I. after 9/11 as a translator, translating intercepts, and ultimately she lost her job. And I asked her if she was afraid of speaking out.

SIBEL EDMONDS: There are times that I am afraid, but then again, I have to remind myself that this is my civic duty and this is for the country, because what they are doing by pushing this stuff under this blanket of secrecy, what they are hiding is against the public's welfare and interest. And reminding that to myself just helps me, to a certain degree, overcome that fear.

AMY GOODMAN: That was Sibel Edmonds. Russell Tice, you are a member of her group, the National Security Whistleblowers Coalition.

RUSSELL TICE: That, I am. National Security Whistleblower Coalition is basically put together of people who are in sort of the same boat that I am in, that have brought whistleblower concerns to the public or to their perspective chain of supervisors and have been retaliated against. And the intelligence community, all of the whistleblower protection laws are -- pretty much exempt the intelligence community. So the intelligence community can put forth their lip service about, ‘Oh, yeah, we want you to put report waste fraud abuse,’ or ‘You shall report suspicions of espionage,’ but when they retaliate you for doing so, you pretty much have no recourse. I think a lot of people don't realize that.

And Sibel has basically started this organization to bring these sort of concerns out into the public and ultimately to get Congress to start passing some laws to protect folks that are going to be in a position to let the public or just, you know, to let Congress know that crimes are being committed. And that's what we're talking about. We're talking about a crime here. So, you know, all of this running around and looking for someone who dropped the dime on a crime is a whole lot different than something like the Valerie Plame case.

AMY GOODMAN: What do you think of the Justice Department launching an investigation into the leak, who leaked the fact that President Bush was spying on American citizens?

RUSSELL TICE: Well, I think this is an attempt to make sure that no intelligence officer ever considers doing this. What was done to me was basically an attempt to tell other intelligence officers, ‘Hey, if you do something like this, if you do something to tick us off, we're going to take your job from you, we're gonna do some unpleasant things to you.’

So, right now, the atmosphere at N.S.A. and D.I.A., for that matter, is fear. The security services basically rule over the employees with fear, and people are afraid to come forward. People know if they come forward even in the legal means, like coming to Congress with a concern, your career is over. And that's just the best scenario. There’s all sorts of other unfortunate things like, perhaps, if someone gets thrown in jail for either a witch-hunt or something trumping up charges or, you know, this guy who is basically reporting a crime.

AMY GOODMAN: And what do you think of the news that the National Security Agency spying on American citizens without a court order and foreign nationals is now sharing this information with other agencies like, well, the other agency you worked for, the Defense Intelligence Agency?

RUSSELL TICE: Intelligence officers work with one another all the time. As an analyst, you might have a problem. Everybody gets together. It’s just common sense to find out what everybody knows, you know, come to a consensus as to what the answer is. It’s sort of like a puzzle, you know, chunks of the puzzle. And maybe you have a few chunks as a SIGINT officer, and the C.I.A. has a few chunks in their arena and D.I.A. has a few elements of it, and everybody gets together and does a little mind meld to try to figure out what’s going on. So it’s not unusual for the intelligence community to share information. But when we’re talking about information on the American public, which is a violation of the FISA law, then I think it's even something more to be concerned about.

AMY GOODMAN: Were you ever asked to engage in this?

RUSSELL TICE: No, no, and if I did so, I did so unwittingly, which I have a feeling would be the case for many of the people involved in this. More than likely this was very closely held at the upper echelons at N.S.A., and mainly because these people knew -- General Hayden, Bill Black, and probably the new one, Keith Alexander, they all knew this was illegal. So, you know, they kept it from the populace of N.S.A., because every N.S.A. officer certainly knows this is illegal.

AMY GOODMAN: What do you mean if you did so, you did so unwittingly?

RUSSELL TICE: Well, there are certain elements of the aspects of what is done where there are functionaries or technicians or analysts that are given information, and you just process that information. You don't necessarily know the nitty gritty as to where the information came from or the -- it's called compartmentalization. It’s ironic, but you could be working on programs, and the very person sitting next to you is not cleared for the programs you're working on, and they're working on their own programs, and each person knows to keep their nose out of the other person's business, because everything's compartmentalized, and you're only allowed to work on what you have a need to know to work on.

AMY GOODMAN: What about the telecoms, the telecommunications corporations working with the Bush administration to open up a back door to eavesdropping, to wiretapping?

RUSSELL TICE: If that was done and, you know, I use a big “if” here, and, remember, I can't tell you what I know of how N.S.A. does its business, but I can use the wiggle words like “if” and scenarios that don't incorporate specifics, but nonetheless, if U.S. gateways and junction points in the United States were used to siphon off information, I would think that the corporate executives of these companies need to be held accountable, as well, because they would certainly also know that what they're doing is wrong and illegal. And if they have some sort of court order or some sort of paper or something signed from some government official, Congress needs to look at those papers and look at the bottom line and see whose signature is there. And these corporations know that this is illegal, as well. So everyone needs to be held accountable in this mess.

AMY GOODMAN: When you come on board at these intelligence agencies, as at the National Security Agency, what are you told? I mean,