Treasurer advises against tax protest
Fri Jun 8, 2007 13:38

From: : If he is the same John Price I am thinking of, he made a run for governor a while back... Also, a fundamentalist Christian, which could play well for the cause-Especially in the rural areas. I just got info back on my taxes. Looks like a 100% increase for me (They left off my exemptions, the idiot Bastards). I'm filing the appeal, with a professional appellate, before I get the bill.

I believe the "legislature" may have formed their own lynch mob this time. It's not just us now, it's everyone getting hit--and, hard! The larger base we can form, the lower the individual cost of litigation will be. So, let's spread the joy! And, increase their pain!!!

We need to hit the fundamental points hard! Foreclosure rates, common school funding legitimacy, usury standards, eminent domain standards, comparative expense &c...One must wonder how many of the vacant home arsons on the South side have a direct correlation to loss of "ownership" by government seizure?

I haven't found any similar cases in the US, but then, most other states have referenda laws (CA-prop 13)...Unlike the greedy swine which won't hear of it here.

Pop in for a brew--or something stronger, and we can try to figure out how to gang up on these school yard bullies!

Hay-Ho, The Uncivilly Disobedient

Treasurer advises against tax protest

Taxpayer threatens to pay same amount as 2006
Courier & Press staff writer 464-7432 or
Tuesday, May 8, 2007

In a protest of 2007 property tax increases he calls "civil disobedience," Joe Webb declares he will pay only what he owed last year.

But Vanderburgh County's top tax collector advises others not to follow Webb's example as Thursday's deadline to pay spring tax bills approaches.

Treasurer Z Tuley says anyone who pays only what he thinks he owes in hopes of winning an assessment appeal is taking a big chance that's not likely to pay off.

That strategy, she says, requires a taxpayer to be exactly right to avoid paying the rest of what he owes, plus a penalty of 10 percent of that amount.

"The likelihood of nailing it right on the head is about the same odds as winning the derby," she said.

Tuley said taxpayers should pay what they owe on their spring tax installments, appeal their assessments in hopes that new deadlines will get final approval, and aim to get an adjustment on their 2007 fall tax bills.

But Webb, a retired payroll manager and auditor for the Evansville-Vanderburgh School Corp., doesn't want to wait that long.

"I'm willing to take the gamble," he says. "It's the principle of the thing."

Webb says he bought his Evansville home in 1993 for $89,300. Last year, the home and property were assessed at $115,300 and his property tax was $1,421.36.

"Now, I'm told that the home and property have been reassessed at $196,200," Webb wrote in a Sunday letter to Tuley. " My tax would be $2,781.62, a whopping increase."

Webb told Tuley no property on his block has ever sold for more than $135,000.

"I know I'm pushing my luck, but here's my proposed solution. I've enclosed the same amount I paid on May 10, 2006," he wrote the treasurer. "I'll be most curious to find out how this defiant behavior works out."

Tuley says it probably will not work out well.

Even if a property owner wins his appeal, Tuley said, he could still get tagged with a penalty if he underestimated what the Property Tax Assessment Board of Appeals ultimately decided he owes.

"Anyone who decides to pay only what he owed last year would have to win his appeal and have (the appeals board) put his assessment back to where they had it (after the 2002 reassessment), because last year's tax bill was based on that reassessment, with no trending at all whatsoever," she said.

In 2002, legislators adopted a trending process that updates property assessments annually based on sales of other neighborhood property.

The market-based assessment system was first used in that year's statewide reassessment. Current property values are based on the work done then. But, while the then-new market value system called for trending every year, lawmakers did not start annual trending immediately after the 2002 reassessment.

They decided to delay it until 2005 in part because county assessors said they needed time to learn the system and get their sales bases in order. The lawmakers postponed implementation for one more year because many assessors said they needed more training.

The result, say several county and state officials, is this year's trending produced dramatic and jarring assessment changes because it was based on several years of changes in the market.
Your Turn

Posted by toeped on May 8, 2007 at 5:33 a.m. (Suggest removal)

I think that it should be law that when you are reassessed the state must buy your house at their assessed value if you demand it. That might keep this in check.

Posted by jones on May 8, 2007 at 5:46 a.m. (Suggest removal)

I admire Joe Webb's stand; however, I see a huge double-standard here. I live in the county and over half of my property taxes are for his former employer (E-VSC). If Joe Webb is willing to take a cut on health care or any kind of retirement benefits, then taxes might decrease.

He is benefitting from the very system that he doesn't want to support.

Personally I think E-VSC has run amok for years for finances and if he was an Auditor, he is personally responsible for their financial chaos.

Posted by awm on May 8, 2007 at 6:14 a.m. (Suggest removal)

This whole thing was nothing but an underhanded plan to increase our taxes. It worked..I feel I have no choice but to pay. I believe they assessed my house about right. I wonder where this big tax windfall will go.

Posted by whodatrotedat on May 8, 2007 at 6:46 a.m. (Suggest removal)

Wouldn't the best strategy for contesting an outrageous assessment be to simply put your house up for sale at the assessed amount? There are already too many houses on the market, and getting them sold has been difficult. What do you think would happen to market prices if the number of houses for sale went up 10 or 20 percent?

And here's another idea. If you are unhappy with this assessment mess, there is something you can do _today_ to make sure the assessors, the city council, and hizzoner know just exactly how you feel: Since the Democrats run this town, vote in the Republican primary. Even if you have to hold your nose, stick cotton in your ears, and stuff a rag in your mouth to keep from gagging, it's the only way they will ever know how hacked off you really are.

Posted by whipple on May 8, 2007 at 6:52 a.m. (Suggest removal)

A property tax AND a sales tax rolled into one ('cept it's not based on the sale of YOUR property).

Posted by Moose1am on May 8, 2007 at 7:22 a.m. (Suggest removal)

Hey Whodatrotedat:
You can't blame the democrats for something the State Senate did to us? If anyone is to blame it's the GOP in the State House. Did you just crawl back out of your cave or out from under that rock?

Posted by lilsavage on May 8, 2007 at 7:34 a.m. (Suggest removal)

I am glad I am not a home owner. The way the article reads I doubt I would own it for long. The government would sell it for back taxes or whatever they do.

Posted by bababowee on May 8, 2007 at 7:51 a.m. (Suggest removal)

Jones has a point. take a look at the reverse side of your tax bill insert titled "Comparison of Levied Tax Statement." Table #2, specifically, the taxy levy for "School District." On mine it accounts for 90% (NINETY PERCENT) of my payable tax due. If you only subtract the Property Tax Replacement Credit from the Gross Tax due, the school levy still accounts for 74% of the Tax Due.

Talk about a whopping chunk of your tax bill!

And EVSC keeps screaming for even more money.

Posted by bababowee on May 8, 2007 at 7:55 a.m. (Suggest removal)

ALSO, everyone keep in mind: The state is going to remove the Homestead Credit in three years. It will be gone. No more tax break for a house being your primary residence. None. Zip. Zilch. Nada.

So unless they make it up somewhere (Circuit Breaker?), we're all getting another whopping increase in three years.

Posted by dholder3 on May 8, 2007 at 8:50 a.m. (Suggest removal)

Taxation run amok. Seems to be everywhere, but Indiana and Evansville in particular. I read recently of Habitat for Humanity built homes were being placed in receivership by the District of Columbia because the homes given free have been taxed at the new trending valuation causing the owner to give it back, as they cannot pay the property tax. Boy, if that doesn't say it!

Posted by hardnose3 on May 8, 2007 at 9 a.m. (Suggest removal)

There is only going to be one loser here. Mr. Webb, I will buy your home at sheriff's auction.

Posted by MalcolmX on May 8, 2007 at 9:11 a.m. (Suggest removal)

From whodatwrotedat: "Since the Democrats run this town, vote in the Republican primary. Even if you have to hold your nose, stick cotton in your ears, and stuff a rag in your mouth to keep from gagging..."

So THAT'S how you Republicans bring yourselves to vote for your horrible candidates every year. I always wondered. Mystery solved. Well, let me tell you how we Democrats vote: With our chest out, chin up and the public's best interest at heart. This whole property tax mess is all Mitch Daniels' fault and the fault of the GOP-led state legislature.

Posted by Evanspatch on May 8, 2007 at 9:42 a.m. (Suggest removal)

Do we trust an elected official with no vowels in her name?

Posted by kcoures on May 8, 2007 at 9:54 a.m. (Suggest removal)

What do you consider "u" and "e" to be consonants? Her name is Zelma Tuley. I count 4 vowels. (And shes really nice, too.)

Posted by kcoures on May 8, 2007 at 10 a.m. (Suggest removal)

Neither the Treasurer or the Auditor or even the Asessor is responsible for this cluster. Its the legislature who did this one, and the previous state governments who put off a streamlined assessment policy for many many years. Z Tuley and Bill Fluty and even Weaver are just doing their jobs using the tools the state gives them. Weaver could have handled it better but he was brand new on the job. Tuley and Fluty are doing the best they can.

Posted by aequalsa on May 8, 2007 at 10:18 a.m. (Suggest removal)

It's about time people get a clue about how much taxes we pay. The only way the uninformed people, which is most of you because I don't see the outrage at the fact of how long you have to "work for the government" until your tax bills are paid. Do you realize everything you earn from January 1st to April 30th goes to the government to pay your taxes? I think the only way for people to realize just how much we owe/spend on taxes would be to get to keep everything we earn and all the everyday taxes we pay and then at the end of the year the governments,State and Federal,would send us a bill to pay what we "owe" to them. If they did it like that you would see how we are being screwed and there would be a revolution much bigger than the one here on one little bitty ole property tax!

Posted by Pepto on May 8, 2007 at 10:21 a.m. (Suggest removal)

If an appraiser appraised a $115,000 house for $196,000 for an equity loan...they'd call it fraud.

Posted by BigMoe on May 8, 2007 at 10:32 a.m. (Suggest removal)

Come on Citizens, do not forget we are at WAR, we all need to pull our socks up and pay a little extra so we can Win this WAR. Sorry the Fedaral govt. cannot help it has to use its money to pay for fighting men and women, in times like this it is called upon the citizens to pick up some of the burden. I know we are all used to welfare, like the state picking up the cost of educating our children or fixing our roads, but when times are difficult, we all need to contribute. This is the price you pay for your FREEDOM, FREEDOM IS NOT FREE... Be a patriot, "you are either with us or with them" (Bush) ... Mr. Webb sounds like he is with them....

Posted by aramis94 on May 8, 2007 at 10:37 a.m. (Suggest removal)

Amen Pepto!!!! Go Joe might lose, but at least you're trying to make a statement. I hope there are several politicians reviewing and paying attention to these blogs. If you haven't got the gist of it, we're sick and tired of all the stupid tax increases you place on us!!!!

Posted by mmagenheimer on May 8, 2007 at 10:44 a.m. (Suggest removal)

A few years ago we were asked if we would "volunteer" to pay more school taxes because E-VSC "needed the money". We all said NO! They need to learn how to live within their budget just like the rest of us. Well, guess what, they're getting their money now. Who's setting these arbitrary new values now, the BCS computer? Why can the increase take effect immediately, but I have to wait an entire year before my mortgage exemption goes into effect? Talk about double standards...

Posted by hardnose3 on May 8, 2007 at noon (Suggest removal)

Evanspatch, you have once again shown you lack enough intelligence to locate you buttocks with both hands.


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